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How To Be a Compassionate Ally for Women in Tech with Salmaan Sana | Show notes episode 128

What if being honest about what we feel was a starting point for being a good ally?

In this episode, Salmaan Sana explains how allyship touches leadership, emotional health and the role men can play to support women in tech. As a former medical student turned leadership facilitator, he brings both personal stories and structural insights to the table. We dig into how vulnerability matters, how small moments can be big for change, and how being an ally isn’t only about what you do — it’s how you show up.

We talk about vulnerability, overcompensation, and the everyday micro-moments that reveal who we really are at work.

Listen on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or YouTube—or scroll down to explore the key lessons from our conversation.

3 Lessons From This Conversation

When Salmaan Sana was a medical student, he stumbled on The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey. That book changed his path. It taught him that leadership isn’t a trait you’re born with, but a skill you can train. He began sharing those ideas with other medical students—long before he called himself a facilitator or consultant. The same lessons still shape how he thinks about allyship today.

1. Focus on what you can influence

Salmaan reminds us that frustration often comes from worrying about things we can’t change. He uses Covey’s idea of the circle of influence versus the circle of concern to help people redirect their energy. In his view, true leadership—and true allyship—start when you act where your influence actually matters.

2. Seek first to understand

Another principle from Covey’s book that stayed with him is listening before responding. Salmaan applies this to allyship: men need to ask women about their experiences rather than assume they know. His barbershop story shows how bias often slips in unnoticed, and how one moment of humility can change the tone of a whole conversation.

3. Sharpen your awareness

Covey calls it “sharpening the saw,” the habit of continuous reflection. For Salmaan, that means noticing your own bias, being honest about it, and learning from it. He openly shares how he once came out sexist and racist on a Harvard bias test—and how awareness, not denial, became his way forward.

These lessons remind us that allyship isn’t about perfection. It’s about awareness, humility, and small consistent actions.

Share this episode with someone who cares about making people feel at home in new places.

Or scroll down for magic moments.

And if you want more lessons like this? Follow the podcast or subscribe to updates for a weekly dose of female founder inspiration.

Or scroll down for magical moments, practical takeaways, and my own observations.

Highlights and timestamps

Time	Highlight
03:00	Journey into Healthcare and Leadership
10:30	The Role of Medical Education in Leadership
20:06	Understanding Allyship and Its Importance
31:45	Men’s Vulnerability and Emotional Health
51:32	Practical Steps to Become an Ally
59:04	Closing the Funding Gap for Female Founders

3 Magic Moments In The Episode

Salmaan’s story begins close to home. He saw his mother’s potential limited by culture and circumstance, and that realization stayed with him. It made him aware of how many women are still held back. Not because they lack talent, but because systems and expectations were never built for them. That awareness became the seed of his allyship. These three stories from the episode bring that awareness to life:

1. Healing starts with understanding, not blame

He shares a story from a woman who worked for the World Health Organization in Congo. She said their mission wasn’t only to heal women after violence, but also to heal men. Because the harm came from inherited trauma and a false sense of inferiority rooted in colonialism. That insight reshaped how Salmaan sees toxic behavior: not as evil, but as pain looking for an outlet.

2. Meeting bias with empathy

Another moment comes from an everyday encounter at a flower shop. A woman he’d just met told him she distrusted asylum seekers. Instead of confronting her, he chose to listen. When she asked if he had ever faced racism, he said yes, many times. But instead of turning it into a debate, he kept the door open for a real conversation later. By staying open, he gave her space to reflect on her own words (and food for thought in the process).

3. The micro-moments that matter

At his coworking space, he noticed a receptionist who looked unwell. When she whispered that she was on her period, he didn’t brush it off. He asked why she felt she had to push through instead of resting. That question opened a dialogue with her manager about creating space for menstrual health at work. It’s a small act, but it shows how allyship can show up in micro-moments: noticing, asking, and making room for change.

These stories reveal how allyship often begins with simple awareness. It’s not about grand gestures. It’s about how you choose to respond in the moment.

💬 What was your magic moment from the episode? Let me know in the comments.

Or scroll down for practical tips that will fuel your own journey as a founder or ally.

Practical Takeaways for Founders and Allies

Different perspectives are essential to close the gap. Salmaan’s stories remind us that inclusion isn’t just about representation; it’s about the quality of understanding that comes from it. Whether in funding decisions, company culture, or day-to-day collaboration, real progress depends on who’s in the room and how they listen to each other.

1. Let skeptics go through their own process

You can’t change people, no matter how strong your argument is. Salmaan says the best way to deal with resistance is to stay calm, keep the dialogue open, and allow others to reach their own realization in time. Change that comes from reflection sticks longer than change forced through debate.

2. Fairness sometimes requires imbalance

In his words, it’s okay to overcompensate for women in the workplace. After all, they’ve been undercompensated for too long. Founders and leaders can apply this by giving more room, resources, or visibility where imbalance has been the norm. Overcompensation isn’t favoritism; it’s repair.

3. From consideration to understanding to compassion to action

Salmaan describes allyship as a sequence that starts with noticing and ends with doing. Consider what others go through. Try to understand it. Let that spark compassion. Then take small, visible steps that improve the environment you’re in. It’s how you turn awareness into culture.

💬 Know a founder or ally who should hear this? Use the share button below to tell them.

Or scroll down to discover an inspiring quote and learn about my own takeaways.

Next, I’ll share the moments from this conversation that shifted how I think about building inclusive companies.

The Quote From The Episode

When Salmaan talks about allyship, he doesn’t hide behind neutral language. He says what many hesitate to say out loud: women deserve some extra support. Not because they’re weak, but because, for too long, women have been undercompensated, underrepresented, and underestimated.

Picture of Salmaan Sana with a quote from episode 128 of the podcast Women Disrupting Tech titled 'How To Be a Compassionate Ally for Women in Tech.'

“It’s okay to overcompensate for women in the workplace.”

Salmaan Sana

3 Things That Changed The Way I Think

This conversation challenged some of my own assumptions about leadership and allyship. It’s what a conversation with a facilitator like Salmaan will do. I want to share three examples where he provided a mirror so I could start seeing how some of my own behaviors work for me—or against me.

1. Relatability comes from being unfinished

Salmaan doesn’t present himself as someone who has it all figured out. He admits that he’s still learning, still catching himself, still rethinking old patterns. That honesty makes him relatable. It’s a reminder that credibility doesn’t come from perfection—it comes from being in the process.

2. The real question under defensiveness

When men are confronted with their own toxic behavior, Salmaan says the deeper question is, “How good do I feel about myself right now?” That one line reframed how I see defensiveness. It’s not just resistance—it’s often a reflection of pain, insecurity, or shame. And seeing it that way changes how you respond.

3. Vulnerability is leadership, not weakness

What stands out most is how he lives what he teaches. He doesn’t share his flaws to prove he’s self-aware. He does it to show others that it’s safe to be honest. That kind of vulnerability isn’t a strategy—it’s leadership in action.

What’s so powerful is that by sharing his own dilemmas and biases, Salmaan helps others shift their perspective and stays open to the perspectives that shift his own.

💬 What changed your thinking? I’d love to hear from you in the comments.

A Question for You 🤔

💬 Which part of Salmaan’s perspective on allyship made you rethink your own assumptions?

👇 Share your thoughts in the comments. Let’s keep this conversation going and make inclusion the new normal in tech.

Coming Up On Women Disrupting Tech

Next week, Gina Schinkel discusses how her ventures, Driftawave and Leaderwave, are strategically capitalizing on the remote work boom by using innovative workations to foster team culture and productivity, while simultaneously preparing leaders and organizations to leverage AI and other new technologies for the future of work.

Gina is clearly a tech and AI enthusiast. So in this clip, she explains why people who risk being laid off because of AI should actually embrace it.

So stay tuned for more Women Disrupting Tech. And until the next episode, as always, Keep Being Awesome!

Dirkjan

PS If you fear missing out, subscribe to updates or follow the show on Spotify, Apple Podcasts or YouTube.

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About Salmaan Sana

Salmaan Sana is a leadership facilitator and organisational consultant based in Amsterdam who brings a rare blend of seriousness and humanity to his work. He started his career in medicine, where he witnessed chronic fatigue, burnout and a system built for endurance — not for wellbeing. That experience awakened his interest in how people and structures respond to change. Today, he works with teams and organisations to rediscover connection, belonging and alignment through inclusive leadership and emotional awareness.

He describes himself as a process-artist who listens deeply, designs with intention and then turns insight into action. Whether through consultancy, workshops or master-classes, Salmaan uses everyday experiences and structural insight to help people move from resignation to agency. His mission is to make the workplace somewhere everyone can show up fully and be heard, not just survive.

In the podcast, Salmaan mentions a TEDx Talk that he gave in 2011. You can watch that on YouTube.

You can learn more about Salmaan on his website and connect with him on LinkedIn and Substack.

Events that Women Disrupting Tech Must-Attend

The fall is loaded with great events, and I’ve found some cool ones. Below is one event you definitely want to check out. For a full overview of all events, including links to buy tickets, please check the events page.

Featured event: Understanding Women’s Health – 3 December 2025

During this final 3mbrace Health event of 2025, you’re invited to better understand the importance of women’s health and the powerful role it plays in our personal, professional, and societal well-being. Men are expressly invited to join. And yes, I will be there too. So buy your tickets on Luma.

That’s What She Said

Looking for an event to start your new year off right? Well, Impowr and Boom Chicago have got your back. They’re starting on 14 January with an event where networking meets comedy. You can get your early-bird ticket (a €10 discount until 30 November) on the Boom Chicago website.

Diverse Leaders in Tech Events

If you like being in the know about what is happening in the DEI space, Diverse Leaders in Tech is the place to be.

Every last Thursday of the month, they have monthly in-person meetups for tech people, HR leaders and supporters of diversity to exchange insights, tackle challenges, and take action. It’s a vibrant, safe space where diversity is celebrated.

You can register for events on the DLiT website. Did I mention that joining your first event is free?

Equals Events

Equals is on a mission to shape a society where women and men stand on equal footing. At their home base in Amsterdam, they regularly organize events, but you can organize yours there too (like the 3mbrace Health events). You can find the events on Luma.

What I Want To Leave You With

We recorded this episode the same week that 17-year-old Lisa was killed while cycling home in Amsterdam. The city felt different that week. Many women, across the country and in the media, spoke up about what it means to not feel safe in the dark. Many men, myself included, started to listen more closely.

It reminded me that allyship is something that needs constant attention and improvement. It’s checking in, asking, and noticing who doesn’t feel safe or seen—and what we can do about it, right where we are.

Salmaan’s work shows that leadership and allyship aren’t separate things. They both begin with paying attention. And they both depend on whether we’re willing to act, even when it feels uncomfortable.

Listen to the full episode on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or YouTube.

20 November 2025

Podcast

Diversity in Tech, Impact, Inclusion, male ally, Podcast, role model, show notes, Women Disrupting Tech, Women in Tech

How to Use Relocation to Build Inclusive Teams with Marieke van Iperen | Show notes episode 127

Marieke van Iperen never planned to become a founder. That only changed after she became a mom and purpose became non-negotiable. She decided to use her lived experiences to do something simple and difficult at the same time. Make people feel at home when they move to a new country.

That belief is the foundation of Settly. And it shows why relocation is not just paperwork. It is identity, belonging, and the human side of moving teams across borders.

But our conversation covers much more. In 42 minutes we talk about immigration, scaling, team culture and safe spaces.

Listen on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or YouTube, or scroll down to learn more about the conversation.

3 Lessons From This Conversation

Marieke shares how her personal experience of moving and struggling to feel at home led her to found Settly. Settly’s core mission is to create a world where everyone feels at home. One thing that stands out in this conversation is how value-driven decisions can scale.

Growth and values can reinforce each other.

Belonging is not fluffy. It is rooted in design. Marieke shows that you can build a company that grows fast without losing sight of community, because growth and purpose are not opposites. They can reinforce each other when you make them part of how you operate.

The right capital is a tool, not the destination.

Bootstrapping first protected Settly’s values. Later, when it was time to scale, she chose impact investors because they understood the link between money and expansion. For her, the capital is not the point. The capital is the tool that unlocks more reach.

Belonging happens in culture, not in forms or packages.

Belonging is not something you solve with a form. It requires trust, curiosity and asking why more often. When people are encouraged to bring their full selves, you unlock a level of connection that actually makes relocation work.

This matters because belonging is often treated like a soft outcome. But this conversation makes it clear that it is the engine behind performance and growth.

Share this episode with someone who cares about making people feel at home in new places.

Or scroll down for magic moments.

And if you want more lessons like this? Follow the podcast or subscribe to updates for a weekly dose of female founder inspiration.

Or scroll down for magical moments, practical takeaways, and my own observations.

Highlights and timestamps

Time	Highlight
03:00	Journey to Becoming a CEO
04:16	Hippie Roots and Startup Culture
05:36	Bootstrapping and Values in Business
06:51	Cultural Intelligence in Hiring
12:15	Navigating COVID-19 Challenges
15:16	Geopolitical Challenges in Expansion
17:16	Overview of Settly and Its Services
19:44	Impact of Government Policies on Business
24:59	Changing Perspectives on Immigration
28:38	Creating Safe Spaces in Companies
44:02	Men’s Role in Inclusivity
45:02	New Features and Closing Thoughts

3 Magic Moments In The Episode

One in three international moves fails. The stat shows what happens when companies focus on getting someone hired instead of helping them feel at home. And it shows the magic in the work that Marieke is doing with Settly. Here are three more magical moments from our conversation.

Turning negative events into opportunities.

Marieke grew up with scarcity. A single mom. Welfare. Hard moments. She learned to pause and look for the lesson before reacting. Over time, that coping mechanism became a source of strength. It helps her make choices rooted in optimism rather than fear.

When a Covid idea became a platform feature.

Settly started online community events during the pandemic. It began as a way to give stranded hires something to hold on to. That experiment became a core feature of the product. It shows how improvisation can unlock something lasting.

Tenant Hub makes belonging practical.

Tenant Hub helps newcomers find each other so they can increase their housing budget together. It is simple and free. And it shows that belonging is not just philosophy. It is product decisions that help people feel at home faster.

These moments matter because they show how belief becomes action. And how action becomes culture.

💬 What was your magic moment from the episode? Let me know in the comments.

Or scroll down for practical tips that will fuel your founder journey.

Practical Takeaways for Founders

Much of our conversation is about belonging. But when we talk about why she bootstrapped and what she learned from getting VCs on board, Marieke shares some great learnings that all founders could benefit from.

Structure helps you fast-track decisions

Getting investors involved forced more structure into the business. That structure helped Marieke and her team make better calls in less time. It shows that the right support at the right moment can help you skip unnecessary rework.

Learning is fun, but not always best for business

The early days of Settly were a lot about trial and error. Only when her investors started challenging her and her partner in board meetings did she discover that she could shorten her learning curve by borrowing patterns that already work.

Curiosity builds belonging

Never assume. Stay curious. Ask why. Take the time to understand someone’s background and needs. Belonging is not an abstract idea. It is the result of these small choices repeated every day.

These takeaways matter because founders often jump straight to execution. But belonging and business good outcomes both require structure and intention.

💬 Know a founder who should hear this? Use the share button below to tell them about the episode.

Or scroll down to discover an inspiring quote and learn about my own takeaways.

Next, I’ll share the moments from this conversation that shifted how I think about building inclusive companies.

The Quote From The Episode

I mentioned Marieke’s ability to reframe negative situations into an opportunity. And I think it is one of her really strong points. This quote captures the essence of what it is about.

Picture of Settly cofounder and CEO Marieke van Iperen with a quote episode 127 of the podcast Women Disrupting Tech titled ‘How to Use Relocation to Build Inclusive Teams’.

“With every downside there is always an opportunity to come out stronger if you pause, reflect and try to take the learnings out.”

Marieke van Iperen, CEO and cofounder of Settly

3 Things That Changed The Way I Think

This episode is slightly different from most other episodes in the sense that we go deep on Marieke’s personal observations. Here’s what our conversation taught me.

One in three moves fails

I knew belonging mattered. But the 1 in 3 failure rate for hires involving relocations surprised me. It shows how often we optimize for hiring instead of human landing. And that we shouldn’t see belonging as a nice-to-have, but as a cost driver.

Different cultures respond differently to stress

When Marieke talked about her own team after the 2023 election, I realized how much background shapes emotional safety. The same uncertainty can trigger fear in one person and curiosity in another.

Angel investors earlier, not VCs earlier

I found this refreshing. We often think “just raise sooner”. But Marieke makes a case that some learning can only happen when you build your own pattern first. That nuance shifted the way I look at funding advice.

These reflections matter because they force me to look at belonging not only as a founder topic, but as a personal one.

What changed your thinking? I would love to hear from you in the comments.

A Question for You 🤔

💬 What was the biggest eye-opener of the episode for you? Was it that 1 in 3 moves fail? Or that we really need the talents to come to the Netherlands and feel at home? Or that the housing crisis plays a role in the debate around immigration?

👇 Share your thoughts in the comments. Let’s keep this conversation going and make inclusion the new normal in tech.

Coming Up On Women Disrupting Tech

Next week, we’ll move back to ally territory. In episode 128, Salmaan Sana teaches us how leadership, emotional health and compassion help us to be better allies.

And talking about allyship, Salmaan has some opinions about what is needed to create a more equal society. Like the need to overcompensate people who so far have been undercompensated.

Click play to listen why Salmaan thinks overcompensation is good.